Just a question

[only a friend]

I'm a Muslim, and I joined this group just to see how Christians think of God, I don't mean any harm or abuse, I just want to learn about you.
I looked around and I was surprised that we have lot's of common things, but we'll always argue about Jesus Christ, peace be upon him.

In our Quran, we think that Jesus didn't die yet but raised to heaven and all Muslims are waiting for his return when the anti-Christ appears, he'll fight him and win and then dies, my question is how do you agree that he dies and yet call him God, since God is immortal

[Scribe D'Nucov]

Dear Only, I noted in one of your answers that you say "God can do anything" yet you say that he cannot come in the form of man and sacrifice his humanity for our sins.

Yet, that is exactly what his word prophetically said! It said Messiah is "LORD" and that Messiah will "suffer and die".

Now, we do not believe that God died. But that Christ died. Christ is the "image of the invisible God". He is the one in whom God was pleased to dwell in his fullness. He was also sinless.

Only Christ can be redeemer and savior. If he is not redeemer and savior then all humanity will die in our sins and by God's own decree we must therefore suffer being cast away from him.

I will ask you, if Christ is not the Holy One, then by what means can we be saved? Because God himself says that he dwells in unapproachable light. He says that he cannot allow sin in his presence. He says that he must punish all wickedness.

So, if Christ is not savior, then by what means may anyone be saved?? How may anyone escape the righteous judgment of God?

I tell you that God's Holy word, given by prophets who did not fail in their prophecies, from Abraham, to Moses, to David and all of the other prophets until Jesus, says that all mankind is under the curse of sin and that sin must be judged. No one can escape it.

So, if Christ is not our atonement for that righteous judgment, then how can anyone escape it? God's word says we all have sinned.

So, God's mercy says he must create a way for mercy. How then can we find mercy from God, when his own decree says all sin must be judged?

Only if one who is great enough to bear ALL the sin of the world were to come, can sin be covered for anyone. For if God is not just, then he is a liar. If God does not truly judge ALL sin, then his judgment is capricious like fallen man and he is no different than us.

But, God is no liar! And God will not fail to keep every word he has spoken!! He will (has) judged all sin by carrying it himself in the form of Christ on the cross. The righteous man of Nazareth, who was the image of God and in whom God's fulness dwelt, carried all sin.

There is no other way. Because God has said there is no other way.

If Jesus did not provide a covenant in his own blood, then what covenant are we under?

[only a friend]

Thanks to all again
God can do anything He wants to; that's right, He told us He is only one and that's why He is not three.
In our believes, since we are not perfect as God wanted us to be since He created Adam pbuh. He asked us all to ask always for his forgivness. We'll always sin and we'll always try to make good and ask for forgivness and that's enough to be saved if you are a believer.

[Scribe D'Nucov]

Dear Only a Friend,

forgive me that I forgot my manners. Salaam - Peace be with you.

One thing you must ask yourself: which writings came first? If the prophet Muhammad was given revelation from God, it would have to be consistent with all of God's revelation. For God is not confused.

Jesus fulfilled the prophecies of the covenant, and he revealed himself to be The One that was to be sent. There is no confusion between Jesus of Nazareth and the prophecies which were given, from Abraham, and Moses through to the entirety of prophets until Malachi and John the Baptizer.

He lived in obedience to the covenant, and he brought a new covenant.

How then can he be a liar? Jesus said he and the father are one, and that he sends the spirit who is also God.

[renae670]

hello and welcome,
jesus is the image of God in a fleshly form. jesus died not God. Jesus was put here to walk as one of us to endure the pain for our first adams sins so he could take them upon him so when His Father's will came to completion we as humans were given grace and mercy and salvation. Jesus went to hell and took the key and rose to the heavens. The devil is and will always be defeated.

renae

[Ron Payne]

Good Morning.....
The answer coming from Islam, is that Christians and Jews have corrupted the Old and New Testaments. Jesus therefore was not crucified and naturally was not resurrected.
What they cannot tell us is why there are no objections from all of the witnesses who listened to Peter on the day of Pentecost when he spoke to the multitude: "Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves know. also Acts: 2:22
Surely if Peter was talking a lot of rubbish, many of them would have said: "Peter your crazy, we don't know what your talking about" Instead 3000 of the listeners repented and were baptized.

AAAHHH! says Islam: "This was written long after the event and the writers could have made up any story they wanted to".
This theory does not hold water. We know that the entire New Testament was completed before 70 AD and thousands of these witnesses +/- 36 years later, would still be alive and could have questioned and denied everything, that was written by the New Testament writers. But again total silence. The silence of thousands of witnesses bares witness to the truth and authenticity of the New Testament.

"Well no fine." Someone says: "How do we know that the NT was completed before 70AD?" It could have been written 100 - 300 years later?
The most important structure to every person in Jerusalem was the Temple. The Temple was the centre and focal point of every day life. For the Jew, life could not go on without the Temple.
The Temple was totally destroyed in 70AD by a Roman General called Titus and all the artifacts, gold etc; was stolen. To the Jews this total destruction of the Temple would have been similar to a 9/11 attack on the Trade Centre. We read all about it from the historians, yet not a word, or even a hint of this disaster and destruction of the Temple can be found in the New Testament. Just as there is also no mention in the entire New Testament that this destruction of the Temple and Jerusalem, caused the Dispersion of the Jews throughout the known world.
The conclusion is simple: When the Temple and Jerusalem was destroyed in 70AD, the New Testament had already been written.

Finally, every apostle except John became martyrs. If all that is said of Jesus was a manufactured lie, there is no way that they would have gone to their martyrdom without attempting to save themselves and say: "It's all lies, Jesus never rose from the dead." Who if not any of us would want to die for a lie?
Also if the resurrection was a lie manufactured amongst the Apostles, plus the woman and other believers in the upper room? How long would it take for at least one of them to tell others: "Don't believe it, it's simply all lies." YET! There is not even any evidence of a rumour being spread, saying that it was simply all lies.
When Islam is confronted with the fact of Silent witnesses, They either leave, without a reply or remain silent themselves.

Yet 700 years later, despite all this evidence, a man who could not read or write, comes along and says the Angel Gabriel told him that the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus was and is all lies. Just as Millions blindly followed Hitler, so millions follow Muhammad. Nazism was a doctrine of war and hate, let it be noted that the recent rise of Islam is no different. Witness the threat to wipe Israel off the face of the earth, Suicide bombers, decapitation of prisoners, passenger planes being blown up in midair and let's never forget 9/11. The world now waits to witness a nuclear attack from Islam. What a contrast to the New Testament doctrine, of Love thy neighbour as thyself.

Post Script. It is an amazing fact that every other religion or cult always attacks one or more of the Biblical evidences regarding Jesus. His position in the trinity, His incarnation, His life, His crucifix

[only a friend]

People never ever agreed about one thing in all history, how come that they all agreed about the Jesus did return from the death as you said Peter says!!
Lets say that he did return after death, why his enemies didn't say something and at least say that this man is a lair and he is not Jesus.
Anothe thing acording to this site http://www.biblestudy.org/beginner/ntbook-dates.html, writing the bible took almost a hundred year. In my point of view, 1 month can changes how do we see things not 100 yrs!

As Muslims as I said many times here, we know that Jesus Christ DID NOT DIE YET and he raised to heaven waiting for his return, when God, Allah, orders him.
Mohammed peace be upon him, didn't ever call for hurting others, and if you say that what happened at 9/11 is an example then I'm sorry for you. Terrorists have no religion and why to call Islam bad because of some acts of some Muslims and denies it from Christians when they do it, Hitler was Christian. And because of words of a government, that happens to be an Islamic government, about wiping Israel from the face of earth, it's a government thing why stick it to Islam!!!

You’ve never read about Islam history and Muhammad before, did you? From a trusted source and not what your history wrote about us
You can not go and just attack Islam, and Muhammad pbuh whose message was nothing but to spread peace. Muhammad who instruct all of his men to not start a war not to kill a child or woman or an old person; his only message that there is no God but Allah. Muhammad who refused to pray God to kill all non believers and said I’m here to show them the way

I’ve never attacked your religion, because I’m forbidden from doing that, I’m saying that what you have now is corrupted; you may have many real issues but it’s not all. It’s really amazing that other religion attack Islam without even trying to understand it first

Sorry for all if you think my question and some of my replies was rude , but my question was to see how you think of it, nothing else

[rix]

He never died as we know it. We do not need to die in the spirit because he showed us how to transcend the mortal body by walking amoung us and remaining God. In english spirit means breath and breath means spirit. He shows me that I don't need my body after it is used up. I pray that you experience him (Jesus) in all his glory as God.

[Angelus5370]

God knew on our own, because we are sinnful creatures, that we could never go to heaven. So God became flesh, suffered, and shed His Blood, so that we may be forgiven, and have a chance at salvation. He was our sacrifice to pay for our sins in full, that is why Jesus is the only way to reach heaven.

[Greg, TheNET Coordinator]

I wanted to let you know that I am closing this discussion because it had moved beyond honest questioning and seeking into a debate whose arguments and counter-arguments are well known and rehearsed on many other websites across the internet. AllAboutGOD.net is not a debate site, it is a site for followers of Jesus Christ to grow in the love for and knowledge of God and to encourage one another. Thank you for your understanding.