Division within the Body of Christ - PLEASE READ

[Jonathan McLatchie]

Dear all,

I feel the Lord has laid it upon my heart to bring forward this message, which I now share. I quote from Titus 3:9-11 (NIV):-

“But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless. Warn a divisive person once, and then warn him a second time. After that, have nothing to do with him. You may be sure that such a man is warped and sinful; he is self-condemned.”

It seems to me that over recent days, people in general on this site have been getting involved in the foolish and unprofitable arguments of which Paul warns. Please do not misunderstand me – I am all up for objective discussions, constructive study and critical examination of different interpretations of difficult passages. But I feel many of them here are starting to evolve into quarrels over “pet doctrines” which are secondary in nature and do not bear any real reflection on maturity as a Christian or on the gospel message and salvation. “Petty quarrels” lead to foolishness, but honest and objective discussion leads to wisdom.

Niels Bohr once said in regard to another field “If you think you are understanding quantum physics, you are not understanding quantum physics”, and I think the same is true of Scripture. Granted there are some doctrines which are abundantly clear and which are non-negotiable, but there are other doctrines which really are not worth causing division over. None of us have all the answers – and if one thinks he does then he is deceiving himself, for if we had all the answers we would live whole-heartedly for Christ, which none of us do. In the words of Romans 3:11, “there is no one who understands, no one who seeks God.” If we claim to be living our entire lives for God then we would have to be without sin, and the Bible makes it very clear that if we claim to be without sin then we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us (1 John 1:8).

People should understand that one of the purposes of the Body of Christ – and indeed this social network – is to seek to serve one another. Instead of sharing together in fellowship and worship, it seems that more and more we are spending time in selfish indulgence, arguing and disputing. If you read 1 Corinthians 1:10-17, you will find further instruction in this respect:-

“I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought. My brothers, some from Chloe's household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. What I mean is this: One of you says, "I follow Paul"; another, "I follow Apollos"; another, "I follow Cephas"; still another, "I follow Christ."

Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul? I am thankful that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, so no one can say that you were baptized into my name. (Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas; beyond that, I don't remember if I baptized anyone else.) For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel—not with words of human wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.”

Here, Paul rebukes the early Corinthian church for their divisions based on loyalties to particular figures. But these divisions always ended in arguments, and the believers were divided by it. This also had profound and far-reaching consequences in other important areas. For instance, those who were wealthy would keep what was theirs to themselves, eating their food before the poorest members showed. This was a complete turn of events from the first Christians in Jerusalem depicted in Acts 2:44.

It seems to me that, as was the case here, we are continuing to be walking in the flesh rather than in the Spirit and we are following our own wills rather than that of the Lord’s.

I refer you to the rest of 1 Corinthians 3, which is of relevance here:-
“Brothers, I could not address you as spiritual but as worldly—mere infants in Christ. I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarrelling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere men? For when one says, "I follow Paul," and another, "I follow Apollos," are you not mere men?

What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task. I planted the seed, Apollos watered it, but God made it grow. So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow. The man who plants and the man who waters have one purpose, and each will be rewarded according to his own labour. For we are God's fellow workers; you are God's field, God's building.

By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as an expert builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should be careful how he builds. For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. If any man builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, his work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each man's work. If what he has built survives, he will receive his reward. If it is burned up, he will suffer loss; he himself will be saved, but only as one escaping through the flames.

Don't you know that you yourselves are God's temple and that God's Spirit lives in you? If anyone destroys God's temple, God will destroy him; for God's temple is sacred, and you are that temple.

Do not deceive yourselves. If any one of you thinks he is wise by the standards of this age, he should become a "fool" so that he may become wise. For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God's sight. As it is written: "He catches the wise in their craftiness"; and again, "The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile." So then, no more boasting about men! All things are yours, whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas or the world or life or death or the present or the future—all are yours, and you are of Christ, and Christ is of God.”

I fear we as the Church – speaking collectively – are beginning to walk more and more according to the fleshly nature rather than that of the Spirit and we are following our own wills and desires rather than that of God’s.

It is my contention that division – where not necessary – is among the first symptoms of spiritual sickness.

As the body of Christ, we must unify the church under one banner - a state where they will be prepared to stand on the authority of the Word of God, whilst prayerfully seeking God's will. Then and only then can there be revival - for how are we to win the spiritual war when there is fighting, bickering, squabbling and throwing of toys out of prams among ourselves? We are on the same team, are we not?

Let there be REVOLUTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What are people’s thoughts on this?

God bless,

Jonathan

[LT]

Scribe,

I am refering to spritual connection. If a person is not saved there is no bond of unity through the one and same Holy Spirit between that person and me. He is not my brother, though he is my neighbor Not to be picky on words, but I have contact with people of the world. I have connection with the family of God.

I would also say that we are to have compassion and love for the lost as is taught clearly in the Bible.

Hope that helps clarify what I mean,
LT

[Greg, TheNET Coordinator]

LT, I absolutely love this post! Amen and Amen! Tremendous and well said.

[Scribe D'Nucov]

LT, I missed whatever got this discussion started. So, bear with me if I'm off topic too far. Sometimes we get too indignant and don't walk in the Spirit.

Don't you just know that both Paul and Barnabbas regretted that they had not been walking in the Spirit at that time? It was God's will that they split up. Fine. Don't you know they regretted that they had not ended with blessings, prayer and the peace of God?

Can we not learn from the mistakes of our brothers of long ago and pray about difficulties? Can we not stand firm without hurting each other?

Paul was right that Mark was being immature. Barnabbas was right that he needed guidance still and that God would work through him later. Why did they not take a moment to stop and pray for God's peace and guidance? Why don't we, when challenges come? Why do we not speak the truth in love?

Can we contend for what is right, without contending against the other person? We are at war with spiritual powers, not flesh and blood and certainly not against those who are trying to understand the will of God - even when they get it wrong.

Let's walk in grace, let's live out the calling of being the embodiment of his light in our life.

Let's love one another as Christ loved us.

- Scribe

[Scribe D'Nucov]

LT, I really like the way you wove your personal experience, some modern church history and Biblical truth together here.

Many times people get on internet media and say things in ways they never would in person. I'm amazed at the folks who write with prose that is so religious that they sound like caricature of someone from another time. You know they don't speak like that to the clerk in the grocery store.

Anyway, I have attended both CMA & AG, but never realized they were born of one original fabric. Now that you mention it, they have many similarities.

You are absolutely right about finding the absolutes! What are the things worth fighting for?

[LT]

Thanks for the kind words. This question goes beyond just a simple answer.

The absolutes do not change, but the type of response will.

The arena will matter. Is it an issue that has arisen in the church, the work place, at the local store or in my family. The place will help determine my response.

Who is raising the challenge? Who they are and where they are coming from will help determine my response.

Knowing the difference between an absolute and a preference will help direct my action when contending for the faith. I must be careful to never move a preference into the catagory of absolute. I wish that we never failed at this, but our weakness will shows through from time to time. The one who is teachable will recover from error. The arrogant will stay the errant course.

I will not give you a list, because depending on whose list it is, much of it will be subjective to the person's personal beliefs. Thus, the reason this whole topic arose to begin with. Understand Johnathan started this forum, the topic of discussion predates this forum here on AAG.

If I wanted to post my list it would be all the truths, as I understand them, regarding the basics of the faith according to the Bible. It would outline what I believe about the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit. What we believe regarding salvation and eternal life. What we believe regarding forgiveness and works related to salvation primarily. I assure you, if I post my views there will be some who will find a word or two, a sentence or three to question. I can deal with that and in fact have come to expect a negative response. Instead of iron sharpening iron, some would just rather use their blade. We need to recognize taht some here, especially the newer one's in the faith, are not able to handle the harsh repsonses and when they get addressed and grilled instead of encouraged and taught in love they go silent or bolt.

I will give two examples that happened and show you when it is necessary to fight for the truth. 1) Recenlty we had three people join AAG at the same time and came in asking three questions commonly used to try and attack and disprove our faith. They were stood against, refuted and expelled. They were not here to help or to seek, but to destroy. There are many young believers on this site that do not need to be attacked and misled by these kinds of people. The flock must be protected. 2) A group came to a church I was an assitant pastor at years ago. Thier group out numbered our church congregation. They came three weeks and then tried to take over the church and expel the pastor. They were not Christian, but Bahai. They were refuted and expelled. We could have viewed them as neighbors and melded with them, or so some would like us to think, but not within the family of God. Israel melded in such ways and lived a life of perpetual repetative failure. Just because we are Christians does not mean we are always passive and never confrontational. I like what the Holy Spirit says through James, JAS 1:19 "My dear brothers, take note of this: Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak and slow to become angry, 20 for man's anger does not bring about the righteous life that God desires."

I know I went off topic some.

Thanks for asking and I Hope this expalins my position in an understandable way.

Lord Bless,
LT

[Scribe D'Nucov]

LT, thanks for the deeper context both for current state at TheNET and your church.

You are absolutely right that we cannot allow false teachings to lead the weak astray. That is, after all, what most of the epistles were written about: correcting false doctrine in the church.

Yet, I do also see that there are those who are seekers, however confused, that get treated like lepers. I think we have to guard against that as well.

My question was somewhat rhetorical. Because fighting in the flesh is not what we should do. Rather we fight in the spirit. Our weapons are powerful, when we use them.

My assessment is that the B'ahai people came to you, because there is something worth attacking. You have fruit there, which the enemy sees that he wants to plunder. On the other hand, he also sent his own to you, where you can possibly reach them. Pray earnestly for those folks that the Holy Spirit convicts them. One of them may turn out to be the next Paul.

Blessings, and thanks again for the detail.

Scribe

[LT]

Scribe,

We are in agreement.

The B'ahai thing was many years ago.

Lord Bless,
LT

[LT]

Donna,

Excellent words to live by. Thanks for sharing.

LT

[Scribe D'Nucov]

Jonathan, you make an excellent point. As I have grown over the last few years, I have come to realize that it is not my place to correct everything I disagree with, nor to prove cases and points at every turn.

That is NOT what the Apostles did, after all.

My goal is to walk with God; live in, and filled with, his Holy power, and when I have done that share what God is doing in me with others. In other words, I am to be a witness of what God is doing in me, through Christ. I cannot be a witness of Peter or John or Paul. They were witnesses to that them selves. I can only be a witness of what Christ is doing in me.

Along the way, I am to encourage, exhort, and on occasion rebuke. I have been learning not to be so harsh or rigid that I am bruising a weaker soul - even when it is clear that they are off the rails.

Our goal is not to prove we "know it all". Our lives should demonstrate the power of God. If not, we have nothing to say.

[Ramona P. Jacobsz]

DEAR BROTHER BOB B
I WAS READING YOUR REPLY 21 JUNE AND ASK CAN WE PRAY TOGETHER FOR A REVIVAL... I AM ALSO PRAYING SO HARD AND THERE IS NOTHING MORE THAN THAT THAT WOULD HEAL THE WORLD.. WE ARE BEAUTIFUL CREATIONS IN A SICK WORLD - SELF INFLICTED - NOT FROM GOD! MAY HIS KINGDOM COME! I LOVE YOUR SINCERITY.

FOND LOVE IN CHRIST
RAMONA P.

[Bob B]

Jonathan I found a great illistration for what you are sharing here.

DIVISIONS IN THE CHURCH
1 CORINTHIANS 1:10-17

Once upon a time there was a body. It had enjoyed a healthy birth and a normal growth. Although there had been times of brief sickness and discomfort, these went through the usual healing processes and the body continued to grow and to function.

Then one day, the toes began to discuss among themselves the importance of wearing comfortable shoes. In the course of the conversation, it was observed that no other part of the body was in the habit of wearing shoes.

"But shoes are necessary for the protection of the body!" exclaimed one of the big toes. "We need to convince the other members of the body that they should also take to wearing shoes. But alas, the other members of the body could not see the need and would not comply with such demands. The toes decided that, for the good of the body, they would separate themselves from the other members of the body.

This had raised the question of what the various members of the body ought to wear. The legs stated that trousers were the only proper apparel. The torso claimed that a shirt ought to be worn. The hands disagreed, claiming that nothing was necessary, but that gloves were acceptable upon occasion.

The members of the body began to quarrel with one another with the result that each member decided to withdraw from those other members with whom there was disagreement.

In the end, the body died.

Sounds a little silly, doesn’t it? Yet this simple story serves to illustrate why there are so many dying churches in the world today.

Corinth was a church divided. There were divisions within the church. These divisions were threatening to tear the church apart. In far off Ephesus, Paul had heard the news of these divisions that plagued the church. He moved to deal with this problem.

[inibehe]

It would have been unfair of me to get through this chain of discussion without adding a word or two.Bro Jonathan, you made quite an impressive observation of what can possibly destroy the joy i derive from this network.worldliness( carnality) is a major cause of division in most Christian groups.Let us not forget that we have a mixed multitude in the network.I want to suggest that people who seek to promote strive and divisions through vain issues should be cautioned with love and if they show no sign of understanding and remorse be delisted. 1Timothy 4:1- Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith,giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils.
Be blessed.
inibehe.